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Vari Speed BP: Phase converter vs VFD

Jik1125

Plastic
Joined
Nov 15, 2018
Hey guys, I’ve been researching the subject for the last few days. Have found some great info but have run across some conflicting opinions as well. Figured I would get some more to help me make my decision.

I purchased a 2HP Vari Speed Bridgeport and have to run it on single phase. Seems like the two best options are RPC or VFD.

Would like some opinions on which to run. If going VFD, what speed should the Bridgeport spindle be left at?

Thanks in advance
 
Why go rotary instead of a solid state phase converter?

If you go VFD, are you just going with a box or going to go with the entire kit to change out the belts and pulleys? If you go with just a VFD box, we aware that your variable discs and the shafts they are on will wear from sitting in one spot.

Jon
H&W Machine Repair
 
Why go rotary instead of a solid state phase converter?

If you go VFD, are you just going with a box or going to go with the entire kit to change out the belts and pulleys? If you go with just a VFD box, we aware that your variable discs and the shafts they are on will wear from sitting in one spot.

Jon
H&W Machine Repair

I suppose it can be a solid state. I gather from your post that you would recommend that over the VFD because of the wearing issues.
 
An RPC is simple, but the initial cost is higher if just for a single machine and you are not making your own, i.e. purchasing something like a 5 Hp RPC. With a VFD, you would most likely use it at a fixed frequency (like 60Hz) and use the mechanical Vari-Speed head to adjust the speed. This will give the mechanical advantage of the pulley ratio w/o the loss of Hp when a motor is used below it's base frequency (60Hz for US motors), you will also get more even wear on the Vari-Speed mechanism. You would use the VFD low voltage inputs for forward/reverse, the motor is directly wired to the VFD. Replace the current rotary drum switch, as the contacts will not conduct low voltage signals well. There are inexpensive three way switches for FORWARD/STOP/REVERSE. You can also program some VFDs to not run with power up should you leave switch in a run position and/or power outage.

If just the mill, than a VFD would probably be the most economical and simplest way to go. There are inexpensive VFDs, but I would not purchase any of the cheap generic ones off of eBay. A mill is very easy to wire up to a VFD, you may want a braking resistor if you want the spindle to stop quickly (like under 5 seconds). If you where to completely replace the Vari-Speed mechanical system with a direct drive belt system, you are looking are considerable more cost, as you also need a larger Hp motor to handle the speed range.
Most recommended VFD for Bridgeport Mills | Wolf Automation
Servo Variable Frequency Drive
 
So if I simply leave the VFD on 60hz I can still vary the speed using the original Bridgeport mechanism???? I just have to completely bypass the frwd/rev switch? Would I be able to use the power on/off button on the vfd as my stop switch?

An RPC is simple, but the initial cost is higher if just for a single machine and you are not making your own, i.e. purchasing something like a 5 Hp RPC. With a VFD, you would most likely use it at a fixed frequency (like 60Hz) and use the mechanical Vari-Speed head to adjust the speed. This will give the mechanical advantage of the pulley ratio w/o the loss of Hp when a motor is used below it's base frequency (60Hz for US motors), you will also get more even wear on the Vari-Speed mechanism. You would use the VFD low voltage inputs for forward/reverse, the motor is directly wired to the VFD. Replace the current rotary drum switch, as the contacts will not conduct low voltage signals well. There are inexpensive three way switches for FORWARD/STOP/REVERSE. You can also program some VFDs to not run with power up should you leave switch in a run position and/or power outage.

If just the mill, than a VFD would probably be the most economical and simplest way to go. There are inexpensive VFDs, but I would not purchase any of the cheap generic ones off of eBay. A mill is very easy to wire up to a VFD, you may want a braking resistor if you want the spindle to stop quickly (like under 5 seconds). If you where to completely replace the Vari-Speed mechanical system with a direct drive belt system, you are looking are considerable more cost, as you also need a larger Hp motor to handle the speed range.
Most recommended VFD for Bridgeport Mills | Wolf Automation
Servo Variable Frequency Drive
 
So if I simply leave the VFD on 60hz I can still vary the speed using the original Bridgeport mechanism???? I just have to completely bypass the frwd/rev switch? Would I be able to use the power on/off button on the vfd as my stop switch?
Some guys wire the original bridgeport switch to the VFD so the on off happens on the machine like before. If you go this route then the VFD can be very simple. Or like you said just use VFD panel for on off, you have options
 
I actually just did this myself. I purchased an L510-202-H1, a 2 HP unit, from Wolf Automation. I direct wired the motor to the VFD, then connected a 30mm 3-position control switch to directly mimic the original switch. I run the VFD at a fixed 60Hz and use the vari-speed to control spindle speed. It is set for a 3 second ramp up time, 2.5 second ramp down, no braking resistor.
 
I actually just did this myself. I purchased an L510-202-H1, a 2 HP unit, from Wolf Automation. I direct wired the motor to the VFD, then connected a 30mm 3-position control switch to directly mimic the original switch. I run the VFD at a fixed 60Hz and use the vari-speed to control spindle speed. It is set for a 3 second ramp up time, 2.5 second ramp down, no braking resistor.

Did you completely remove the old switch? I’m assuming the new switch is wired to the vfd and not the motor? Sorry totally new to the electrical side.
 
The old drum switch is removed, as the motor is directly connected to the VFD. The VFD controls the motor direction through low voltage inputs, so a 3 way maintained switch is needed and can be mounted on the head in a small box. You can add an E-Stop which would disconnect the low voltage power input to the switch. There are a number of different options, but what is described above is the simplest.

You will still need a power disconnect for the VFD, you can set the VFD to run at a fixed frequency with different ramp up and down times. I have had some installs with the L510 on mills, they can trip with short braking times if running high speed or in back gear, you can always back down the braking time. Just be aware that the 230V L510 does not support an external braking resistor, but can work ok on mills but not on lathes.
 
I suppose it can be a solid state. I gather from your post that you would recommend that over the VFD because of the wearing issues.

Ya, I mean your unit is already a variable speed head, so keeping the pulleys in one spot will wear them both alot. If you are gonna just use a VFD as a phase converter, why waste the money on the VFD just go with a phase converter.

Jon
 
This may seem like a dumb question to some of you... if you are using a VFD, does your cable/breaker have to be rated for the amperage of the vfd or the amperage of the mills motor?
 
Input amperage of the VFD x 125%. Typically the VFD manual will indicate the recommended breaker/fuse sizing, usually a 30A breaker is ok for 2 and 3 Hp VFDs, although I have run 2 Hp single phase input VFD's off of a 20A breaker 3 Hp off of 30A breakers with no problems. The VFD protects the motor and it's wiring based on the parameters you set.

Example below,
vfd fusing.jpg
 
So if I simply leave the VFD on 60hz I can still vary the speed using the original Bridgeport mechanism???? I just have to completely bypass the frwd/rev switch? Would I be able to use the power on/off button on the vfd as my stop switch?

I have a Leeson VFD on my Bridgeport, same type as yours. It actually has a control block, so you can wire in the fwd/rev switch to use it as if you're just hooked up to 3 phase. It is very convenient and super easy to wire. Also, just keeping the VFD at 60 Hz and running the speed with the vari-adjustment is the easiest way to go. I really like the option of soft start, but I really haven't had a reason to get any deeper into the other functions.

Just have to be careful not to shut the thing down to quickly or the VFD faults from the motor turning into a generator.
 
Sum of both. But the power consumption of VFD itself is small.

Sorry, I don't think that is correct. Why would it have to be the sum of both? The VFD is running the motor. The rating of the VFD should be much higher than the motor, since it is providing a regulated power source. The input current rating of the VFD +125% (or whatever your local electrical code suggests)implies that the full load current of the motor (which is less)is satisfied when the full load current of the VFD (which is higher) is obtains. Am I off my rocker? If you sum them, that means you will burn out the VDF if either the motor or the VFD goes haywire. Wire you size for the load, that is, between your panel and the VFD and between the VFD and the motor.
 








 
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