Frommia circular saw. Help needed.
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    Default Frommia circular saw. Help needed.

    A rather long shot. I’m rebuilding a German-made Frommia circular saw. Machine type KSE is indicated in a label on the machine.
    This appears to have originally been a combination machine but only the circular saw remains.
    Machine is extremely heavy, built like a battleship.
    -Would anyone have a manual for this machine? Any language will do, I can have it translated.
    -There’s spherical lubrication fittings on the machine, are they meant to receive oil or grease?
    I'll be grateful for ANY help.

    001.jpg002.jpg003.jpg001.jpg

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    I've seen those spherical fittings on other 1960's and older German made machines. It's made to work with a concave cone shaped lube fitting. The gun would have a pump action neck so that as you press the tip against the fitting it pumps in lubricant. I think the manual would only tell if it was for oil or grease, but I don't think this style of lub fitting would lend itself towards the high pressure of a grease pump action.

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    Thanks for your reply, M B Naegle. I have a grease pump originally from the toolkit in an old British truck which perfectly fits those spherical fittings and functions perfectly; however,this pump is meant to handle only grease, will not handle oil. Those spherical fittings can be easily changed to regular Zerks, but then am I doing the right thing using grease as a lubricant? As you said, the manual would indicate whether oil or grease should de used. Finally, is there an oil pump that will work with those fittings?
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    Most lub guns that are meant to work with oil and zerk fittings will look the same as a grease gun. The difference is how they seal the reservoir that holds your lub. Some guys have modified grease guns to work with oil, but I'm not sure of the process.

    Without the manuals direction, I would look at what the fitting is lubricating. If it's a low speed part like a hinge or pivot point, grease is often the answer. If it's a higher speed part like a spindle, or the fitting is positioned so gravity can help the lubricant flow, it is often oil. There are also many grades and kinds of both oil and grease that work differently, but beings as this is "just a table saw," I'm inclined to think it'll be a more common lubricant like a 30 weight oil or a NLGI #2 axle grease.

    Any lubricant will be better than nothing, but without knowing what it's supposed to be or how often it's meant to be done, you need to keep an eye on things. If the lubricant can't stay in its designated place and runs out, you'll likely have to do it more often. If there's any chance of dust or debris getting into the moving part, lubricant can help flush it out, but only if it's flowing out due to pressure or gravity.

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    Very good observation about speeds. Al parts that need lubrication are low to very low speed, like a worm screw and sliding surfaces. I changed the original open ball bearings in the spindle that required application of grease to sealed ones which don't.
    It's confusing that the same fittings are used everywhere in the machine regardless of the duty involved.

    I modified the business end of a hand oiler to fit those spherical 6mm (3mm radius)fittings, made a female part with a .250 ball end mill, close enough and it seems to work so I'll start with oil which is easier to remove than grease if it doesn't work.

    Hopefully I'll find a manual, Frommia is still in business.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RODELU View Post
    A rather long shot. I’m rebuilding a German-made Frommia circular saw. Machine type KSE is indicated in a label on the machine.
    This appears to have originally been a combination machine but only the circular saw remains.
    Machine is extremely heavy, built like a battleship.
    -Would anyone have a manual for this machine? Any language will do, I can have it translated.
    -There’s spherical lubrication fittings on the machine, are they meant to receive oil or grease?
    I'll be grateful for ANY help.

    001.jpg002.jpg003.jpg001.jpg
    I have a Frommia thicknesser and Frommia spindle moulder which both have those fittings. I've been using grease applied with a needle nose grease gun as I've had the spindle moulder spindle apart and it seems to be designed for grease, with labyrinth seals and felts to keep dust out and no way to keep fluid oil in. I'm using amsoil synthetic grease which is fairly fluid. These is a lube plate on the machine but very faded.

    One thing about Frommia stuff is that it is extremely well made and well thought out- I like the castor arrangement.
    Does your saw have a triangular makers plate at all?
    Frommia did make some of their combination machines as single purpose machines as evidenced by my thicknesser- the model was made as both a over/under combination and a thicknesser only; mine has only ever been a thicknesser as evidenced by the castings, factory filler and paint.

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    Hi Greenwud,
    Using a low-viscosity grease is probably a good idea, a balance between oil and grease; Amsoil is not available over here, what is the viscosity of the grease you use if shown in the tube?
    Same kind of labyrinth seals are used in the spindle but oddly there are no felt or rubber seals.
    My machine does not have that triangular label you mention.
    I do believe this was originally a combination machine since there are several unpainted milled surfaces and empty threaded holes on the sides.
    There are remnants of an eccentric device at the very bottom of the machine, might have been a rolling system (now frozen solid by rust), might have been part of the original casters.
    My shop is rather small so having my machines on casters is a must; would you please provide details on the casters in your machine? I'm worried that regular casters won't take the weight of this machine.
    I fully agree about the construction quality of the machine, I’ve learnt a lot while doing this job.

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    Greenwud; further to my question about grease viscosity, there's probably an "NLGI Consistency Number" in the package ranging from 000 to 6, indicating viscosity.

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    I think the Amsoil is a NLGI #2 weight but I'll check. Its a good product as the oily component doesn't separate from the rest as some greases do. I've found trailer bearings last 4-5 x longer with it compared to Castrol LMX.
    The castors at the back are solid steel on a steel axle. The front has the eccentric that you mention, which is actuated by a ball tipped lever to lift the front of the machine off the ground, and also steerable by the lever. It works well.
    It's possible that the machined sections on your saw were for a sliding carriage
    I'll post some photos...

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    The Amsoil is a NLGI 2 grease
    Photos of the steerable castor on the thicknesser, its label and the lube plate off the spindle moulder- which refers back to the lubricating instructions.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_0011.jpg   img_0012.jpg   img_0013.jpg   img_0014.jpg  

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    Hi Greenwud. Many thanks for the photos and for the data on the grease you are using.
    The steerable device is easy to reproduce but I’m concerned about those steel wheels you mention, the floor in my shop is plywood which will surely be damaged by wheels which I presume are no wider than 35mm. Il look into making much wider Delrin wheels mounted in ball bearings; those wheels would spread the load but still. the weight of this machine is overwhelming.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RODELU View Post
    Hi Greenwud. Many thanks for the photos and for the data on the grease you are using.
    The steerable device is easy to reproduce but I’m concerned about those steel wheels you mention, the floor in my shop is plywood which will surely be damaged by wheels which I presume are no wider than 35mm. Il look into making much wider Delrin wheels mounted in ball bearings; those wheels would spread the load but still. the weight of this machine is overwhelming.
    The ones I took off the back of my spindle moulder were only about 25mm wide and I replaced them with a series of polyurethane ball bearing rollers which came off a textile machine- the axle goes right through. This of course leaves the steerable castor, which has 2 x 15mm steel wheels and I imagine they will mark a softwood floor.

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    Hi Greenwud´
    I made some progress with my Frommia; the steerable system turned out to be not at all easy to reproduce [/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]313342 002.jpg004.jpg[ATTACH=CONFIG]313347 and the rusted steel wheels and axle at the back refused to cooperate so I built a rolling platform with a steerable front wheel similar to the original, turning on a push bearing but not lockable like the original was. If being non-lockable becomes a problem when using the saw all I can think of is a couple wedges under the platform.
    I’m still looking into the lubrication issue; one thing at a time.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 001.jpg   005.jpg  


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