What new 8" or 10" jointer?
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  1. #1
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    Default What new 8" or 10" jointer?

    Looking to replace an older 6" jointer. Suggstions please on which machine from users of 8" or 10" jointers? Have 220 single and three phase power. Also have a surface grinder so resharpening blades is easy. Thanks.

    L7

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    I'm not a fan of new jointers because I don't think the cast iron is ground very flat but if you go new, get a parallelogram design. Wedgebed were great on old industrial machines or even the Northfield and oliver old 8" because the table was bolted to the wedge. New jointers cast the table and top of wedge together so if the tables aren't co planar you are doomed. The Delta DJ 20 if made in Brazil or Taiwan is a decent used choice. If you plan to spend over 2K, look for a 12" rather than smaller. Better machine, better design, and better materials. Dave

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    I'd also consider a used jointer in the 12-14" or so range for the same price as a half decent (and likely still Chinese import) 8" or 10" new one.

    If you find a nice board wider than 8", it's a shame to have to rip it up just to get it flat. If you resaw larger stuff, it's nice of you can get a flat face on that larger stuff. If you prepare blanks for woodturning . . . you get the idea.

    If you've already got a decent 6" jointer, 8 or 10" probably isn't going to change your woodworking life . . . 12" under the guides of your bandsaw, a 12" jointer, and a 12" planer seem the next still-affordable step up?? Then 14" . . . 16" . . . .??

    My own is a 14" Mini Max jointer/planer bought used and formerly mated to a Laguna bandsaw with 18" under the guides; but there are at least half a dozen brands of decent US, Italian, German, etc. ones. The only drawback (for me) on the MiniMax is the relatively short table; partially rectified by my adding 8" heavy aluminum extensions to each end -- and rollers if needed.

    Maybe a good used jointer near you, from an estate sale, cabinet shop downsizing, etc. Biggest drawback to the old jointers is that they use plain knives -- and also why they might go cheap. But, since you've got that surface grinder not so much of a problem for you. There are also quick change retrofit kids for many of the older jointers -- perhaps worth considering if this is more than a hobby and you need to resharpen and replace often.

    If new, by all means consider the newer cutter heads.

    Stephen Thomas is perhaps our resident expert on all things woodworking (and many things metalworking). Perhaps he'll see this and comment.

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    Nothing wrong with straight knives in a jointer.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

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    If you're looking to move up to an 8" the only ones I'd consider (and I've had) are the Rockwell 8" wedgebed (1970s), the Delta DJ20, and my latest acquisition an older Powermatic 60 (8"). If you want to move up to a 12" consider the 1980s Powermatic FS-305. This is an Italian machine built by SAC Machinery. I currently have one and preparing it for sale. The bed is beefy and well ribbed. Mine is the green version. A 12" is not just 4" bigger than an 8", the 8" rockwell/powermatic are about 300lb, the 12" over 1000, keep that in mind. I initially bought the 12" for the longer bed to edge joint. Once I got a horizontal slider I don't need it for edges anymore and is why I downgraded back to an 8".

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    I'm not familiar with new jointers. As has been mentioned, all that are commonly available in the 8" & under size tend to be built down to a price. The old (or new) 12" machines built since the 1920's tend to have tables that can be adjusted one way or another to be co-planar with the cylinder (cutterhead) & each other. This is essential for a jointer.

    I agree with Pete that if you have the space, 12" is the next logical step for cost efficiency and for working efficiency.

    Quality new 8" and larger jointers get quite expensive fast.
    Note 2 things in Northfield's price list (scroll down to page 21):

    1.) not cheap.
    2.) 12" machine, for all practical purposes at that level, costs the same as 8"

    http://www.northfieldwoodworking.com...t-NMB-2018.pdf

    Still considering new machines, the Japanese make good products, we seldom see them here because they are not inexpensive.
    Wilke (defunct) used to import fairly well made Chinese jointers, though you have to inspect each one. I don't really trust Green Bear machines, they tend to be built too lightly with small ways and delicate parts in the essential details.

    Then there are a range of well built Euro machines that I am not familiar with or where to buy new.

    Most of us watch, wait, and carefully inspect the industrial machines made sometime after the mid-late 1920s that come up for auction or at estate sales. Oliver, J A Fay & Egan, Northfield, Porter, maybe Moak, there are others; as well as many older Euro machines such as Martin, Panhans, Wadkin & several other german & English machines made since ww2. SCM (Italy) has made some very good machines as well, I think some of the imported large Rockwell jointers were initially SCM/SCMI before Rockwell either cloned them to make in Brazil, or discontinued them.

    good luck!
    smt

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    Always liked the DJ-15 (6 inch) and the DJ-20 (8 inch). Used ones from the 80s.

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    Just talked to a supervisor from the Smithsonian’s display department. His fab shop is replacing some big equipment. A 18” planer and an 11” joiner will be showing up on the GSA auction site soon. The best part was he offered the family a behind the scenes tour. I’m stoked! Into the guts of the museums to see and talk to the craftsmen that put it all together. A real gentelman too!
    Joe

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    Way to go, Joe!

    Take your camera

    smt

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    Posted this is a different place so SMT would get it. A bit off topic. My apologies.
    Hi Stephen,
    Can’t figure how to contact you otherwise. Really enjoy your posts about using the old small Sears three knife heads. I have a c. 1990 Robland X31 euro combo. The shaper has a flat head machine screw to hold down the cutters (runs at 6000 rpm). I chamfered the bore on one of the five Sears heads I bought on eBay. It works great now as a cope head. I ground back two knives with a stubby projection on the bottom to balance the head (used a scale to weigh them). I have a couple euro blocks, rebate head with knickers. lockedge collars, etc. but the Sears head with one knife cutting is very smooth, fast to grind a knife, and old school. Newer shaper limiter tooling seems to be designed to reduce injury from inattention and boredom in a commercial setting. I’m always doing special setups, guarding, short runs, and never bored running the shaper. Some of the very old Sears cutters with the slot have bigger holes more like the big Delta molding head, but the set screw still pushes the knife slot firmly onto the head. It works great, cheap, and I can’t thank you enough.

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    Thanks, Michael.

    Play safe, don't do anything that feels iffy, and don't get blase.

    I'm not sure the heads are actually rated that fast, think the tenoner is around 5K rpm. I generally keep under 6,000 on the shaper, but would have to look at the steps to verify actual rpm.

    Also have broken some with a long projection on the tenoner, so as you already note, take that into account.
    Keep the knives as short as possible for 2 reasons: safety, and the short knives chatter less. But they do open a lot of inexpensive options for quick tooling.

    smt

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    I hear you. The heads were originally marked to run at 6000 and bored to 3/4 so I think I’m ok. The Corob head, the co. that made them for Sears, now has them marked at 4000 but bored at 5/8 to market them only for table saws. I started buying the old Sears heads because I can find them for about $20 and then set them up and leave them. I’ve even used them just for spacers.

    My shaper is a 1 1/4 spindle with a top section that is 3/4 and a flat head screw that normally goes through a special chamfered collar into the spindle and clamps the tooling down. When I chamfered the Sears head and placed the right amount of spacers underneath it on the 3/4 part of the spindle I can hold it down with the flat head screw and then use it as a cope head with long tenons. The machine has a sliding table so even though its not a real tenoner it works for what I want. The heads cut very smooth for profiles with three knives cutting - better than a small diameter carbide three wing cutter.

    I could order a large tenon head from Schmidt with it counterbored, etc. but this is a hobby now and the tooling money they want for stuff is crazy.

    I noticed you made some special dummy balance knives. Any tips for how you made them? Thanks again for your knowledge and depth.

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    Anything with an indeaxable insert planing head


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