Tool Changing in general and on a SuperMax Rebel 1

[hackish]

I'm new to the CnC gig. I bought a SuperMax Rebel 1 and discovered it is a basket case, so I have been repairing it piece by piece.

I've tried reading a lot of howto's on tool changers, but advice is always machine and control specific. Unfortunately my Meldas 520A control is not that common.

How would a machine know if there is a tool in the spindle or not? Do you always unload before shutting down? There are no sensors in the ATC to know if a lot is empty or occupied, and I don't think it can tell if the spindle is empty or not.

I also can't figure out how to load/unload it. Does one normally load the hat directly by hand, or do you manually insert them into the spindle, enter offsets, then have the ATC load it to the carousel, or is this also machine specific?

I've tried T01M6 in the MDI, then cycle start but it does nothing. Occasionally it gives error codes like incorrect axis or ATC failed but they aren't in my manuals. I have been finding and killing the electrical and mechanical problems, but this is hard to figure out if I am not commanding a tool change properly from the start.

One reason the ATC wasn't working... Fixed already, replaced all the hoses to it and tested movement manually with compressed air.

 

[vmipacman]

The ATC runs on air?
Isn't the umbrella carousel turned via a electric rotary actuator and moved under the spindle with a electric gear reduced swing arm?
Only the air-over-hydraulic drawbar needs air.

You may try the M6 before T01. It matters on the Fanuc control.

You load the tool carousel by hand, kinda hard to reach but faster, or like you describe, pop it in the spindle. I had two LED readouts, one showing the current tool number it "thinks" is in the spindle, and another showing where the carousel is. Just call another tool and it will store the one in the spindle in the location it thinks it belongs. MAKE SURE THERE ISN'T A TOOL ALREADY THERE!

Thats right. Machine is dumb to what is where. That's up to you.

 

[13engines]

I'm a little confused by the words you're using. Does your machine have a swing arm type tool changer where your tools sit horizontal or a carouse/umbrella type where the tools are vertical?

More pictures of the tool changer/ machine might help too.

Personally not familiar with the Meldas control, but generally the control keeps track of what tool is where by keeping track of the movements of the changer and it's drive and clamping mechanisms..

The info below is geared towards a swing arm tool changers. I have no experience with the other type.

Yes I always remove tools from the spindle before shutting down. Usually by calling T0M6. Though your results may vary.

It doesn't matter how you load the tools, though for starting out, I suggest calling a tool to the spindle with M6, then load it there. To load directly into the carousel you have to know what tool is assigned to what tool pot. That info could very well be buried in the diagnostics section of the control. What I'm also saying is tool pot 6 for example does not always hold tool 6. It could hold any tool. (Remember, this paragraph may not apply to an umbrella type changer.)

 

[vmipacman]

Here is how it works on a Fanuc.
I know nothing about Mits Controls.


Most important, always make sure the toolchanger is pushed back so the X22 LS is closed. It won't home itself.

 

[Hardplates]

then load it there. To load directly into the carousel you have to know what tool is assigned to what tool pot. That info could very well be buried in the diagnostics section of the control. What I'm also saying is tool pot 6 for example does not always hold tool 6. It could hold any tool. (Remember, this paragraph may not apply to an umbrella type changer.)

I have a VMC with a random address tool changer and a Meldas 330. It has a tool registry page which is easy to use and located right along with the tool and work offsets. Holds 18+1 tools but accepts up to 40 numbers. More was an option. I don't know if the tool registry page is a Mits thing or done by the MTB......

 

[mjk]

I would suggest getting the tool changing mechanism to work before loading any tools
You don't need tools in the pots/pockets to do a tool change call
Until your comfortable with the process of how the changer works, and how the tools are assigned to the pots, you may save yourself a jam from the machine trying to put a tool in a pot that is full (umbrella type) or a flying tool that hasn't loaded correctly. (they make a lot of noise when they bounce)



agree good practice to remove the tool from the spindle when not using machine at the end of the day

 

[twr]

As said above my Fanuc OM is MO6T6 ect yours maybe different. I think the umbrella moves over then grabs the tool then the hole carousel moves down with air or hydraulic the carousel rotates goes back up to install new tool. Mine is a rebel 3 and way different umbrella moves over puts tool back in carousel and spindle goes up carousel rotates spindle comes down grab new tool umbrella moves back home. Not sure why tools changes are so much different between rebel 1 and rebel 3 even the same year machines. As said above do not put any tools in it untill you figure out how it works, you don't want to be replacing the umbrella because it got smashed with 2 tools in same pocket!!

 

[Vancbiker]

How the control handles the tool changer is determined by the machine builder's ladder logic program.

The Meldas 500 series have a tool "registration" screen that most builders will use. On the OFFSET screen you should have a softkey that says REGIST. If you don't see that press the OFFSET key until you see REGIST. Press REGIST and you should get a screen that shows what tool is in which magazine position. For an "umbrella type" magazine the tool number and the magazine number typically match, but it's up to the builder to determine if they will allow setting a different tool number to a magazine position. This screen also has the ability to display the spindle tool number.

Alternately, the machine builder can use the PLC Counter or Data tables. These tables start at setup parameter 6200 and runs to 6349.

 

[hackish]

All great advice. The umbrella is rotated with a motor, and it is lowered and extended by air. This is an umbrella style, not the quick change one that has a rotating arm to grab and replace the tool from the spindle.

I have not tried M06T02 in that order.

At present I get
<Stop Code>
T02 FEED HOLD
<ALARM MESSAGE>
1019 M6 AXIS MISSED


This is also suspect, but it isn't clear if there is something else missing or not. I feel like they should have grounds or supply on the other side of each.

 

[13engines]

From what I can see is that wire on the top right is disconnected and should be connected next to the one there. Meaning it should look like the connections at the lower left.

Hmmm... well on 2nd thought, maybe check in your books fist. Though it does look like a feed through for a normally open switch contact.

 

[Hardplates]

From what I can see is that wire on the top right is disconnected and should be connected next to the one there. Meaning it should look like the connections at the lower left.

Good eye!

K8 definitely doesn't look healthy. Looks kind of like the copper work hardened and broke off between the connection and the insulation

 

[mjk]

possible remnant still locked in the terminal strip?

 

[13engines]

...This is also suspect, but it isn't clear if there is something else missing or not. I feel like they should have grounds or supply on the other side of each.

Those look to be two pole relays. I bet the sparseness of physical connections is due to the idea that most of the connections being made are traveling in and out of that multi conductor cable and traces on the I/O board. The physical connections there are perhaps for options tied to other functions. User convenience. Who knows.

But if you ask me... that loose wire there is just itchin... I mean itchin to be connected up next to its brother there. I can feel it! Hopefully neither of them is a smoker. :-)

BTW - I wish my Supernmax 3 had simple connections like this one does. Mine are all soldering on the back side of plate mounted plug in relays. Not fun... or handy.

 

[Vancbiker]

.......At present I get
<Stop Code>
T02 FEED HOLD
<ALARM MESSAGE>
1019 M6 AXIS MISSED......

The alarm 1019 is a machine builder alarm. I suspect that you were not at the G28 or G30 Z0 position when you commanded the toolchange.

 

[hackish]

I'm no G-Code expert. I didn't know that a G command had to be issued before a tool change. This is maybe a machine specific issue, but I wonder if there is a typical way you would tell the tool changer to go to a vacant spot while other stuff is going on, tool change comes up and the ATC would already be there. Spindle goes up, changer puts the tool into the vacant spot, selects the new one and puts it in.

Electrical issue has been fixed and the switches verified. The only remaining problem is a mechanical issue preventing the toolchanger from advancing fully into position. The YCI folks are top notch at responding and helping to debug. Maybe I'm jaded from other industries where companies don't give a @#$#@ for their customers, but I am truly impressed.

 

[Hardplates]

I'm no G-Code expert. I didn't know that a G command had to be issued before a tool change. This is maybe a machine specific issue, but I wonder if there is a typical way you would tell the tool changer to go to a vacant spot while other stuff is going on, tool change comes up and the ATC would already be there. Spindle goes up, changer puts the tool into the vacant spot, selects the new one and puts it in.

Electrical issue has been fixed and the switches verified. The only remaining problem is a mechanical issue preventing the toolchanger from advancing fully into position. The YCI folks are top notch at responding and helping to debug. Maybe I'm jaded from other industries where companies don't give a @#$#@ for their customers, but I am truly impressed.

Some machines have to be sent home to execute a tool change, others have it built into the tool change macro.

What you are referring to is a random address tool changer which is how side mounts are set up. I don't know that an umbrella can be configured that way (I have zero experience with umbrella changers) An umbrella changer is a budget oriented tool changer so I would not expect it to have fancy options or a complicated ladder in place.

If you set up your tool numbers in order that should help with tool change times since an umbrella can't pre-stage tools