10ee apron oil pump not working

skydawg · Jun 22, 2016

I knew oil wasn`t getting to the cross slide or saddle,thought the metering units were clogged.After removing the apron,the oil pump seems to be the problem,not a trace of oil movement.I blew compressed air into the output line,still nothing.Is there anything I should check before pulling the pump?Could it need to be primed somehow? Thanks.

skydawg · Jun 22, 2016

With the pump out of the apron,the screen and lines are very clean.The piston,doesn`t travel more than 1/16"when actuated by the "lifter".Shouldn`t there be more travel?

CowDriver · Jun 22, 2016

I had the same problem after cleaning and re-assembling my pump. I must have pumped it several hundred times without a trace of oil coming out. It turned out that the pump must be thoroughly primed before you install it. Take it out and completely immerse it in oil. Then pump it the full cycle (about 1/2") until no more air bubbles come out. Take care when re-installing it to not let any air get into it.

I, too, was concerned about the piston traveling only 1/16" when assembled in the apron, but that appears to be sufficient. But when I started cranking the handwheel, I got plenty of oil coming out the hole in the top of the apron.

Alan

skydawg · Jun 23, 2016

Thanks Alan.Some PO used silicone or Form-a-Gasket on the sump to apron facing.I was wondering if this was needed,and might it have reduced the travel of the lifter,and therefore piston travel in the pump.

oldster · Jun 23, 2016

There is very little movement, and every bit of it is needed to force the oil to flow. If the ball seat is slightly rough or pitted, you will lose flow.
Use a small flat bottom punch resting on top of the ball, and tap it lightly to re-seat the ball.

Lee (the saw guy)

skydawg · Jun 23, 2016

Lee,I`m not getting any blow-by from either check valve,I believe the pump is soundjust needs to be primed as Alan stated.So is a sealant recommended between sump and apron,or not necessary? Thanks.

CowDriver · Jun 23, 2016

skydawg said:
Some PO used silicone or Form-a-Gasket on the sump to apron facing.I was wondering if this was needed,and might it have reduced the travel of the lifter,and therefore piston travel in the pump.

Mine had what appeared to be an original gasket which fell apart when I removed the sump. I just made a new one from 0.012" (or so) gasket material. I also used Hylomar Blue non-hardening sealant. I don't see how either of these could have any effect on the piston travel. There are lots of people on this forum who know lots more about these machines than I do, so I hope they will correct any errors I make.

Alan

skydawg · Jun 23, 2016

The distance between the"pushrod" and the"lifter" that moves the piston is increased by whatever the thickness of the gasket,any decrease in the travel of that lifter will mean less piston travel,no?

CowDriver · Jun 23, 2016

skydawg said:
The distance between the"pushrod" and the"lifter" that moves the piston is increased by whatever the thickness of the gasket,any decrease in the travel of that lifter will mean less piston travel,no?

Perhaps I am confused about which gasket you are talking about, or what you mean by "sump". The photo below shows what I am talking about. The rectangular piece in the foreground with a gasket on top of it is what I am referring to as the sump. The oil pump is not affected in any way by the sump and gasket I show here, as it is already solidly screwed to the apron above.

Alan

skydawg · Jun 23, 2016

Excuse my brainlock...for some reason pictured the pump as part of the sump,which it isn`t.Not easy being dumb.

skydawg · Jun 23, 2016

That`s a nicely made gasket...looks factory.

CowDriver · Jun 23, 2016

skydawg said:
That`s a nicely made gasket...looks factory.

Thanks, I've been getting a lot of practice since buying an orphan car (Humber Super Snipe).

My technique is to cut a blank slightly larger than the part. Then I use a ball-pein hammer to mark & cut out one hole. With a suitable rod (drill bit?) in the first hole, I make a second hole at the other end and put a rod there. Now I can lightly tap all around the edges and remaining holes. If the edges of the holes are sharp enough, the gasket holes will simply fall out.

In the case of a gasket like this, I often don't bother to mark the outside edge. I simply bolt the pieces together and then run a razor blade around the edge. Much faster.

My favorite gasket sealant is Hylomar Universal Blue. It is non-hardening, and can be used either with or without gaskets, depending on the quality of the surfaces. It allows you to remove and replace covers multiple times without having to use new gaskets each time. The stuff is expensive, but I believe that it is worth every penny. Several companies make stuff that pretends to be the genuine article, but I only buy the real thing. If it doesn't say Hylomar on the package, it's a knock-off.

skydawg · Jul 5, 2016

After removing the output check valve,I can see that the end of the "piston"rod is never "below" the port,even when bottomed out by the actuating lever,so the port is never open to let oil out.I`m not having any luck getting the collar off the spring/plunger,so I can disassemble,the collar appears to be threaded on,but is frozen,and getting any part of this in a vise is a problem.I have a punch that`s a snug fit in the hole in the collar to use as a sort of spanner,but I`m not able to keep the whole assembly from rotating.I`m guessing that the problem with the rod not clearing the port lies in it`s connection to the plunger.Any wisdom would be welcome.

oldster · Jul 5, 2016

First of all, lets sort out the knowns from the unknowns.
Drop the pump out of the apron. You can do this just by removing the 4 bolts holding it in place.
Immerse it in a can of oil and actuate it until it pumps oil. It it does not pump, the pump needs working on.
If you get oil pumping, you now have something that works. Now, reinstall pump and try again.
It is always one step at a time.

Lee (the saw guy)

skydawg · Jul 5, 2016

???Lee,did you read my last post?

Ixzed13 · Jul 10, 2016

Can I ask if there is a felt type filter normally on the suction side of the pump? The pump of my CVA 1A had a miserably small ball of fibers between the two screens. Photos at
Instagram

Thanks.

Daniel

rke[pler · Jul 10, 2016

Bijur has a filter kit for the pump. I'd look it up but am on a different computer that doesn't have the 10EE data. You could also call Monarch and check to see if they have a kit handy, I recall that they did (once) and it was cheaper than Bijur.

Ixzed13 · Jul 10, 2016

Thanks. The thing is, I am not sure it is a Bijur. The parts manual does not say Bijur.

Daniel

skydawg · Jul 14, 2016

So the pump is fine,but the actuating lever is worn where it contacts the handwheel and feed cams,to where the pushrod doesn`t travel enough to draw the pump piston back far enough to clear the outlet port.Monarch wants $159 for a new lever,so I`ll have the old one built up with brazing.

rimcanyon · Jul 16, 2016

skydawg said:
So the pump is fine,but the actuating lever is worn where it contacts the handwheel and feed cams,to where the pushrod doesn`t travel enough to draw the pump piston back far enough to clear the outlet port.Monarch wants $159 for a new lever,so I`ll have the old one built up with brazing.

I have two NOS Monarch pump levers, still with the tag on them. Contact me offline if you still need one.

10ee apron oil pump not working

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Hot Rolled

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Aluminum

Hot Rolled

Aluminum

Aluminum

Diamond

Aluminum

Aluminum

Diamond

Similar threads