Who the heck uses 415 volts ?

[Milacron]

Bought first ever machine that requires 415 volts input. I thought Europe was 380 or 400 volts...who is 415...UK ? AU ? Afganistan ?? The Vatican ???

 

[kjbllc]

it looks like they are using it in data centers for one leg only?
http://www.datacenterfix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=60

 

[kjbllc]

Re: Why choose 120 volts?

 

[Torque1st]

415 is twice 208.

 

[Jraef]

3 phase voltage in "IEC" countries ( essentially everywhere but North America) used to range from anywhere between 380 - 415V, with the phase-neutral voltage being 220-240V. For example, England was primarily 240/415, while the rest of Europe was 220/380. There was "harmonization" in the EU a few years ago (2006?) to 230/400V, but that is still essentially theoretical and for new installations. there really hasn't been a change in what the utilities produce, just in the labels put onto equipment. The 230/400V is a compromise that allows the different distribution voltages to fall within design tolerances.

The UK is still primarily 240/415, as is Australia (but New Zealand is 230/400).
Most Continental European countries are still 220/380, but Germany has officially changed to 230/400.

If you think that's confusing, what's the 3 phase voltage standard in the US?

 

[Jraef]

415 is twice 208.

That has nothing to do with it, strictly coincidental.

 

[Jraef]

Bought first ever machine that requires 415 volts input. I thought Europe was 380 or 400 volts...who is 415...UK ? AU ? Afganistan ?? The Vatican ???

Just so you know, 415V 50Hz is roughly the same V/Hz ratio as 480V 60Hz. So you can use 480V supplies to your motorized equipment. The motors will run 20% faster because of the frequency difference, so they will technically put out more HP and you need to make sure that doesn't cause you any problems. But do NOT buy a transformer to step down to 415V and then feed it with 60Hz power, you will smoke your motors.

 

[Jim McIntyre]

That has nothing to do with it, strictly coincidental.

"Coincidental"? Isn't 416 simply the line-to-line voltage in a system that provides 240 line-to-neutral in the same way that 208 is the line-to-line voltage in a 120/208 wye system?

That's not a coincidence, it's the square root of 3...

 

[Jraef]

"Coincidental"? Isn't 416 simply the line-to-line voltage in a system that provides 240 line-to-neutral in the same way that 208 is the line-to-line voltage in a 120/208 wye system?

That's not a coincidence, it's the square root of 3...

Sure, but what does that have to do with 415 being (roughly) twice 208?

 

[Torque1st]

Jeez, give us a break with the nonsense!

415 is essentially the same as 416.

Some motors are rated for 208/416 service, or 200/400, or 230/460, etc. Motors are even supplied for special voltages all the time. Many industrial and commercial areas have 208/416 3 phase service. I have used 208/416 motors myself for customer applications. 50/60Hz, foreign and domestic power systems all mix things up. People even stamp rating plates incorrectly. "Stuff" happens.

Voltage "standards" change over the years like our household voltage "standards" have changed: 110/115/117/120/125 I have 125/250 at my residence.

 

[bdx]

The european 380-400v harmonisation came in several years ago.

415V was a uk standard (prior to harmonisation)

 

[RC99]

In Australia we are nominally 240V single phase, 415V three phase... Although officially we are 230V/400V....

We have a tolerance (AS 60038) of -6% +10% so 240V is within the 230V tolerance and 415V is within the 400V tolerance.

IEC 60038 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[peterh5322]

The historic voltages in North America are or were 220, 230 and 240, as North America is essentially a ∆ world.

The corresponding EU and world-wide voltages are 1.732 times these, as the rest of the world is essentially a Y world.

1.732 * [ 220, 230, 240 ] = [ 381.0512, 398.3717, 415.6922 ] , or [ 380, 400, 415 ] for short.

It is really that simple.


In the past, more EU countries used 380 and 415, but the EU decided on "harmonizing" at the average of these three, or 400, even though few countries actually used 400.

For the same reason, some US manufacturers have standardized on 230 and 460, although the US voltages have tended to be higher for a great many years.

 

[peterh5322]

"it looks like they are using it in data centers for one leg only?"

The large mainframe computer and peripherals manufacturer with which I was formerly employed offered 380 and 415, for our world market customers.

However, our domestic market customers were offered 208-240 for single-phase and low-power three-phase.

All our high-power machines, wherever located, were 415 Hz, 208 volts, three-phase and consumed between 70 and 140 KVA.

70 KVA was provided by one motor-generator set; 140 KVA was provided by two motor-generator sets.

 

[curious_student2024]

Just so you know, 415V 50Hz is roughly the same V/Hz ratio as 480V 60Hz. So you can use 480V supplies to your motorized equipment. The motors will run 20% faster because of the frequency difference, so they will technically put out more HP and you need to make sure that doesn't cause you any problems. But do NOT buy a transformer to step down to 415V and then feed it with 60Hz power, you will smoke your motors.

Dear Tesla @Jraef ​

any chance you explain exactly why it might burn?​

The situation is we use 415 with step down transformer instead of 480 so lower voltage, i understand that V/F control requires maintaining the ratio of 8 but still cannot connect the dots..

 

[Rob F.]

Dear Tesla @Jraef ​

any chance you explain exactly why it might burn?​

The situation is we use 415 with step down transformer instead of 480 so lower voltage, i understand that V/F control requires maintaining the ratio of 8 but still cannot connect the dots..

Pretty sure he means that if you use the transformer to lower the voltage the frequency will not lower so your voltage to frequency ratio will be off.

 

[Peter.]

Bought first ever machine that requires 415 volts input. I thought Europe was 380 or 400 volts...who is 415...UK ? AU ? Afganistan ?? The Vatican ???

3 phase power in the UK is commonly referred to as 415V. Has been that way for as far back as I can remember.

 

[steve-l]

415 was the UK standard, but about 20 to 25 years ago it was decided by the European community to normalize the electric power standard. The continent voltage norm rose to 400V from 380 and the UK dropped from 415 to 400.

 

[Mark Rand]

Looking at my single phase voltage in the house, just now, it's at 245V. Which would be 424V phase to phase.

PS:- this is a bit of a necro-thread...

 

[Doozer]

Looking at my single phase voltage in the house, just now, it's at 245V. Which would be 424V phase to phase.

PS:- this is a bit of a necro-thread...

Leg to leg. Not phase to phase. Phases are between the legs.

-D